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THIS IS A SITE FOR PEOPLE OF ALL AGES! *must read*
Guys... tell me why THIS is on a site for people of all ages: http://mocpages.com/moc.php/176133

It has too much content for a lot of people are on here. It is a cheap perverted laugh. Why does this get front page? You're telling kids its good? There was some bad stuff in there... I'm going to quote it:

"In the bed there's a lady named Juli
She pretends that I am big and brown

When she asks me "are you ready?'
I'll say, "whoa mam!"
"Let's wait until my wife is out of town!"

THIS IS NOT GOOD. If you guys are actually mature adults you would do something about it! Kelso... please help!
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 7:56 am
This is wrong. It teaches young kids (who go here often) that these things are ok... premarital $ex is not ok.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:05 am
Phipson and his "gang" of nerds are getting cheap laughs from this "comedy" they are spitting out of their mouths. I will get nasty until this comes to an end. It breaks all of sean's rules.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:07 am
This is insanity. Phipson is leading a group of n-e-r-d-y adults who have no life into ruining the next generation. They teach bad qualities to children at young ages. It is immature... and this is coming from someone who is not even 15! Good will not come of this. Many were offended by this. I am offended by this. There are 10 year olds on here. I will not remain silent for another second!!!!!
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:09 am
10 year olds are on mocpages.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:09 am
are you aware of this. We need a real man to lead in this situation. An AFOL that can step up and get in the faces of the other immature AFOLS!
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:12 am
 Group admin 
Quoting Ryan T. M.
Guys... tell me why THIS is on a site for people of all ages: http://mocpages.com/moc.php/176133

It has too much content for a lot of people are on here. It is a cheap perverted laugh. Why does this get front page? You're telling kids its good? There was some bad stuff in there... I'm going to quote it:

"In the bed there's a lady named Juli
She pretends that I am big and brown

When she asks me "are you ready?'
I'll say, "whoa mam!"
"Let's wait until my wife is out of town!"

THIS IS NOT GOOD. If you guys are actually mature adults you would do something about it! Kelso... please help!


Ryan, I can appreciate your concern on this. As a parent of two, I certainly wouldn't have let my kids see this when they were younger. (mind you, as an adult, I found it absolutely hilarious!) So let me ask, did you read Lee's "Mature content" warning at the beginning? If so, why did you procede with reading the remainder of the post? I felt it was very responsible of him to say at the beginning, and more than once, that the post contained mature content and was not suitable for younger viewers.

I agree that it is not something that kids such as yourself should see, but as a moderator, I also am asked by Sean to allow the members of MOCpages as much personal freedom as possible, PARTICULARLY on their own pages.

Of course, that doesn't mean letting ANYTHING through, and if I get word from Sean that he feels it's broken the rules, and would like me to remove Lee's page, I will certainly do so immediately.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:35 am
I think the above is incredibly well built, and funny, if slightly (OK, very) creepy. However, I'm afraid I agree with Ryan.

Just because the quality of the build is exceptionally high doesn't make it OK for kids to read it. And about the warning at the top - please, that's more an encouragement.

If a worse builder had made something so obviously sexual I bet it would be removed by admins pretty quickly.

Awesome build, and lighthearted, but there are very young children who use this site, and although this will sound like I've had a sense of humor bypass, it's simply not OK.

Admins should look at the content, not the quality


Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 9:14 am
Bet I'm now on the AFOL's Blacklist!
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 9:16 am
Quoting Ape Fight
Bet I'm now on the AFOL's Blacklist!

I wish to step in here. No one is on the "Blacklist" for Expressing their opinion. This is an open site and you are free to disagree. On another note, Lee did place a warning at the beginning of the post, so with that in mind, those that might be offended should have ceased reading. One other note, both moderators looked at and commented on the MOC, and Chris already stated that it broke no rules. Now unless Sean sees otherwise, as Mark said, then the creation is an expression of art and humor. I for one laughed like crazy. Would I let my 10 years old daughter see it, no, but that is why Lee put a warning on it. I applaud Lee for his creativity and his uncanny ability to make me laugh out loud.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 9:40 am
 Group admin 
Quoting Ape Fight
If a worse builder had made something so obviously sexual I bet it would be removed by admins pretty quickly...Admins should look at the content, not the quality



The issue of build quality, or the fact that we know Lee, doesn't factor into my decision to allow the post to remain. What DOES factor into my decision (and I can't speak for Chris here, but I'm sure he'll chime in when he signs on) is that Sean has expressed, on numerous occasions, his desire to allow the builders here on MOCpages as much personal freedom as possible, particularly in their own "house" (i.e. their own pages). That's the bottom line for me.

Now, if Lee had not provided an initial warning to younger viewers, or had posted something with a tone of disrespect or dissent, I would feel his intentions were more an attempt at being offensive or in blatant disregard of the rules, and would probably have either deleted the page, or suggested to Sean that it be deleted. However, that wasn't the case with Lee. He made every effort to provide a notice of the post's content (out of respect for younger viewers), and his intentions when creating the page. And if this had been a builder that I had never heard of or spoken with, my stance on the matter would still be the same.


Quoting Ape Fight
Bet I'm now on the AFOL's Blacklist!


Not on my list, anyway. You have EVERY right to express your perspective. This is going to be a hot topic for a while, and I, personally, am interested in hearing other's thoughts. I may or may not agree, but once again expressing Sean's desire for freedom of expression, I think you have the right to speak your mind.

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 10:31 am
can we just here what sean has to say and get it over with
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 10:47 am
Quoting Dave Shaddix


Brick Freak, cool your jets dude. You have a point, but its askew. He is dealing with his issues, he is bringing his dissatisfaction to the attention of the AFOLs and MOCpages Admins. Some of his issues may be more subjective in nature, making it unreasonable for Sean to address them in the manner in which he would like. But they are legit issues, so play nice.


I just deleted my comment. I don't want my emotions to cause something I'll regret later.

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 1:12 pm
Quoting Dave Shaddix

A single line saying DON'T READ THIS isn't warning or effort.

Kids don't read warnings, adults do. That being said, I can't sit and watch over my son as he surfs a site that I should trust.

In my eyes, this isn't an issue of 'should this be allowed' or 'this is inappropriate'. Because yes it should be allowed, but for this site, as it is today, it is VERY inappropriate.

Does it stand up to the Prime Time TV rule? No. Take a show like Family Guy, they issue a warning before the show to get all the kiddos away. The show also runs at 8pm on Sunday and on Cartoon Network, its on Adult Swim, late at night... 14 and under clearly isn't their target audience. Putting ANY 'R- Rated' MOC that isn't meant for the kiddies on MOCpages is comparable to running an R rated cartoon (or something visually appealing to children but not appropriate for children) with a warning on a Saturday morning after the Smurfs. The warning won't do a darn bit of good and you are putting it smack dab into the prime viewing of the little ones.

I don't want to see content disclaimers here anymore, we need to have tools in place to control who views the content. If you should have to disclaim it, it belongs somewhere else until we can control this. I have thought this for a long time, well before this latest batch of drama. I can go out and find DOZENS of other MOCs, ones created by kids too (and probably me), that are inappropriate for one reason or another. Simply put, we need to shuffle things around and create account types and/or a rating system. ...I wish I was a programmer right now.

I am facing down a very real issue here and strongly weighing the option of no longer allowing my kids access to MOCpages until I am comfortable with the ability to control the content they see. Right now I have binary control, on or off. If this is the way I go, I'll be locking it down at my router, so you won't be seeing this AFOL for a while either.




YEAH! That is right. What you say is 100% agreed with. I didn't even see the warning lol. hahahahha!

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 1:25 pm
ut oh... lock it if u want. k?
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 3:57 pm
notice how Phipson hasn't commented on this? I like him, I think he's a great guy, just look at one or two of his MOCs. tell me waht you find...
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 4:05 pm
Quoting James Hawke
Agreed, Lock It!


Er... why should anyone lock this? Just because we've said our 2 pence doesn't mean other people shouldn't get their chance.

Trigger happy moderating...
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 4:36 pm
Ryan. not to be rude but unless your homeschooled you should know how rude kids are today. seriously. I thought it was funny. I also felt like i need to pump my stomache and brush my teeth but i still laughed. And besides if the kids didnt think it was funny it wouldnt have gotten front page.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 5:15 pm
 Group admin 
I think I'd prefer to leave the thread open. If someone's got an opinion on the matter, then I'm interested in hearing it.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 5:39 pm
 Group admin 
The issue of premarital relations is a personal choice. Ryan, you are entitled to your opinion of course and I encourage you to believe in your choice. But remember... it's a choice, not a law.

As for Lee, I've stated my opinion in the other thread, so I won't go on and on about it here.

As for offensive content in general. "Offensive content" is a subjective term. Let's put it this way. There is an image on THIS page that I find EXTREMELY offensive but I'm keeping my mouth shut becuase it's my opinion, not a rule. Like Mark said, we, the moderators, have been instructed by Sean to give each moccer as wide a berth in their creativity as possible. Until we're told otherwise, we're standing by our decision.

Like I've said a thousand times, I personally find the act of violence a LOT more offensive than the act of love. Blood, gore, killing and explosive skulls are perfectly ok, but please GOD don't show a breast! I mean come on!??! Where are your priorities?

The final word on this is this. Sean has told us to give builders as wide a berth as we can. Lee posted a WARNING on the top of the page explaining that anyone under 21 should NOT look further.

If Sean wants the moc taken down, he'll let us know. If not, then there's your answer. I don't make the rules, Mark doesn't make the rules. SEAN makes the rules.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 6:58 pm
Quoting Ape Fight
Bet I'm now on the AFOL's Blacklist!


I KNEW the AFOL's forgot to give me something. Where is the authorized blacklist gentleman?!

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 7:01 pm
 Group admin 
Oh boy did YOU just pick the wrong battle.

Ryan, you have a LOT to learn. I understand that you were offended by Lee's moc AFTER you blantently ignored the warning that was clearly posted. Now... Let's go through point by point shall we?

Quoting Ryan T. M.
This is insanity. Phipson is leading a group of n-e-r-d-y adults who have no life into ruining the next generation.


Did you just claim to know something about my life? You have NO CLUE who I am and what I do when I'm not here on MOCpages! How DARE you insult me by saying that I have "No life." Where do you get off?

And as for "Ruining the next generation." You just insulted my daughter! You're the one sitting here talking about being a good person and what's right and wrong and yet you have NO CLUE how to properly behave in social circles. If you and I were in the same room, would you say that to my face? No, you wouldn't. Learn some respect before you go spouting off about what you "THINK" is right and wrong.

Quoting Ryan T. M.
They teach bad qualities to children at young ages.


I'm sure reading is a good quality. Perhaps you should have chosen to do that before going on your holy crusade and accuing ME of something that someone else did! If you're going to lay blame, figure out WHERE to lay it before you go insutling ME!


Quoting Ryan T. M.
It is immature... and this is coming from someone who is not even 15! Good will not come of this. Many were offended by this. I am offended by this. There are 10 year olds on here. I will not remain silent for another second!!!!!


Exactly. You're not yet 15 which means that you have a LOT of growing up to do. Anyone who was offended by Lee's moc was offended because they IGNORED the warning at the begining of the post!

And as for YOU being offended? What do you think you just did to me? Someone else posts something that YOU don't like so you come over here and INSULT me and my parenting skills? What's your problem? Before you go off on your holy crusade, maybe you should think twice about who you're going after. I didn't do ANYTHING to you and your insult will NOT be forgotten any time soon.

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 7:43 pm
Quoting Chris Phipson

Exactly. You're not yet 15 which means that you have a LOT of growing up to do. Anyone who was offended by Lee's moc was offended because they IGNORED the warning at the begining of the post!

And as for YOU being offended? What do you think you just did to me? Someone else posts something that YOU don't like so you come over here and INSULT me and my parenting skills? What's your problem? Before you go off on your holy crusade, maybe you should think twice about who you're going after. I didn't do ANYTHING to you and your insult will NOT be forgotten any time soon.

You tell him Phipson!
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 7:50 pm
Quoting Phazezorz .
... Tis' a sad day when a 13-year old can act upon himself in a higher manner than a 14-year old.


Are you talking about me? BTW the meaning?
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 7:58 pm
Quoting Chris Phipson
Before you go off on your holy crusade, maybe you should think twice about who you're going after. I didn't do ANYTHING to you and your insult will NOT be forgotten any time soon.


Oh yeah, go Phipson! Hey Chris, would ya mind looking at my newest moc... (P.S. there is a reference to you in it! Haha)
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:01 pm
Quoting Phazezorz .
No, me.

And it basically means I am acting higher in manner than Ryan.

Though it is all opinons, I presume.

Alright, I thought you were talking about me. Since I thought you were talking about me I didn't get what you were saying. BTW you are 13 too! Never knew that.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:01 pm
As much as I disagree that the content in lee's moc is inapropriate, (especially for mocpages) I just try to stay out of it. It's not my fight to pick. Sure I'm a kid, But i'm mature enough to see the difference between right and wrong. I'm also mature enough to realize that just becuase Lee acts a certain way, And does certain things doesen't make it right, and it sure doesen't mean that I should act the same, And do the same things, Just becuase he's older than me.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:02 pm
Quoting Ryan T. M.
10 year olds are on mocpages.

Like me... I feel for you, Ryan T. M.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:29 pm
Just my $.02...

I think it would work better if, rather than some accounts being 'restricted', people could choose when they were making a moc page to make it invisible to people less than a certain age; for instance, if someone made a moc and felt it should be invisible to anyone who was younger than, say, fifteen, they'd set the minimum age to 15.

I don't really know how to explain it, but, based on the birthday they set when they made the account, people who hadn't yet had their 15th birthday wouldn't be able to see the page.


Is that legible?

Anyway, I think it would be less trouble; rather than expecting the kiddos to set their accounts accordingly, the people who posted the 'inappropriate' content would select the rating.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:33 pm
Quoting Dave Shaddix
Quoting Chris Phipson
As for offensive content in general. "Offensive content" is a subjective term.


Again, I am going to fall back to Sean's "would I show my 5 year old?" "Or my mother?"

and your Family Guy logic. MOCpages is (conservatively) 80% kids. Would you, even with a disclaimer, play Family Guy, or ANY R-rated or NC-17 movie during Saturday morning cartoons or on a channel like Nickelodeon? I say NC-17 because people are saying 18 and up.

The AFOLs are outnumbered here, we always complain and moan about all the kiddos and the drama they cause. We know they are here. We should treat MOCpages accordingly, like I said ...Nickelodeon, Smurfs, Behind the Green Door?

I AM... under 12! I like, uhhh, NCIS, CSI: Miami, you should too! And Family Guy... I mean common, it's pretty funny! I DON'T CAUSE drama... I made Mark "laugh"...
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:35 pm
Quoting James Hawke
But the warning does tempt little kiddies to look at it.


So? They read the warning, they looked anyway, they don't get to complain.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:44 pm
Quoting Phazezorz .
Caps....

Are not needed.
Nor are the Exclamatory marks, with the Caps.

I am that KIND OF PERSON!!! HaHaHa. Ha. Hey, I was chatting with my friend from school on the PS3, and he called me Mr. Willy Wonka! Strange. Okay, we never speak of that... again. EVER. Now we "drop it" (?) kk. byezy. Just joking.

See, the way I think of those [thinies] on the keyboard are friends of mine. They help me express myself. When I use Caps and periods, I am somewhat frustrated. When I use Exclamatory marks AND Caps I am... well phsyco, or crazy. And when I use just exclamatory marks, I am happy and/or mad. See, you have to understand before you chat with me.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:45 pm
Quoting Phazezorz .
...

This is what makes me the unsociable miser I am.

Don't say that. HI! How is it going, Sir? I mean, Yo Yo Yo, sup dude?
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:52 pm
 Group admin 
Quoting Dave Shaddix

Again, I am going to fall back to Sean's "would I show my 5 year old?" "Or my mother?"


Actually, Sean said that you can say what you would feel comfortable saying in your own living room. I don't remember him saying anything about a 5 year old or my mother. I'm not saying he didn't, I just don't recall that. And actually... my mom would think this stuff is hilarious! Not just the mocs mind you, but the fact that people are SO worked up over this issue.

Quoting Dave Shaddix
and your Family Guy logic. MOCpages is (conservatively) 80% kids. Would you, even with a disclaimer, play Family Guy, or ANY R-rated or NC-17 movie during Saturday morning cartoons or on a channel like Nickelodeon? I say NC-17 because people are saying 18 and up.

The AFOLs are outnumbered here, we always complain and moan about all the kiddos and the drama they cause. We know they are here. We should treat MOCpages accordingly, like I said ...Nickelodeon, Smurfs, Behind the Green Door?


Like I said above, Lee's living room. You and I and everyone else can not like it as much as we want. The fact is, he didn't step over the line as far as Sean is concerned. If Sean wants the moc deleted, then it's his site. As for the rules laid down to me by him, this moc did not break any of them.

Your suggestions for pro accounts, rating systems, ability to block certain builders and so on are all great ideas and we've talked about them before. How quickly Sean can impliment them (if he's even going to that is) is another story.

In the mean time, Lee can post what he wants to post. Trust me on this when I say that I've deleted mocs (and had accounts banned) that DO have inapproriate content and... this wasn't it.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:52 pm
Quoting Phazezorz .
...

This is what makes me the unsociable miser I am.


Well, as I said elsewhere, if the average person had any brains at all us sensible TFOLs would probably be more sociable.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:52 pm
Quoting Areetsa C

Well, as I said elsewhere, if the average person had any brains at all us sensible TFOLs would probably be more sociable.

I am a TFOL in about, (break the code) 2+10+6-4+2=16

16+1+2+1-7-10=??? (read and do the math of both parts.)
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:56 pm
Quoting Phazezorz .
Both of your attempted greetings to socialize with me are too....

well, boring, for my tastes.

Wanna MOC-OFF!? DUDE!? OO!? ;)

I'll be friendly now. Hey man! How was your Holidays? Good? What do you bauild next? HUH?
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 8:58 pm
Quoting Phazezorz .
Dude, too easy.

6x^2-45xy+8x^2y^2
Solve that.

I'm still too simpleminded to solve that, but would that be:
8x^(2y)^2 As in 2y to the power of 2 or
8x^2(y^2) As in 2 * y^2?
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 9:16 pm
This thread is full of lolz. Some people just don't get it. I saw the warning, I used caution went on a little bit, saw some things that weren't in my tastes, and I clicked the back button. And I did it all without crying and screaming about inappropriate things!

Too bad most people aren't that reasonable. No one forced anyone to read on, yet some did, and they got mad. I don't get it. That's like Phaze delibrately going into another branch's church and saying he doesn't think they should celebrate Christmas. Well, that's not a good example, I can see Phaze doing that.

Point is: I agree with Areetsa about the restricted warning. But then MOCpages would loose it's child friendly-ness, and Sean would have parents yelling at him. Again.

Hmm...
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 9:18 pm
Quoting Phazezorz .
Nay, you need to apply the ax^2+b-c, when a>1 and c is negative.

My head is screaming. :P I take it that's Algy 2... Or I'm looking at the whole thing completely wrong. At least the SAT has simpler questions.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 9:27 pm
Ummm, wow; this is way over the top.

There are certainly a lot of good comments and points here. There are also some less than intelligent ones too.

Dave: if my kids came across something that said that you have to be 21 or older to read it, they would not read it. I know you are a good dad Dave, and I know the sacrifices you have made, so please don't think I am insulting you. Just as I was not insulted by your comments.

I expect that all the kids on these pages would be like my kids: "Daddy, is this appropriate?" is what they would ask me. I would expect all the kids to avoid that page. If they don't, then they made a (bad) choice.

I would ask: "Where are these kid's parents?" My kids at almost 12 and 9.5 do not go on the internet unsupervised. They are allowed to go onto webkinz, and similar. They are not allowed to go onto mocpages/flikr/facebook, where they can be exposed to interactions with adults - PERIOD!

I am not here to parent these kids, I am here to interact with the AFOLs and the mature TFOLs. I comment on kids mocs (even Halo and Clone Wars) to be encouraging. I am not parenting. If these kid's parents are allowing them to go on these sites unsupervised, then I think the shame is closer to their homes than it is to mine.

I have no shame for what I posted, it is an artistic expression. It is tasteless humour sure, it is immature too. But it is my page. I am not religious, but I would not put down somebody for posting a cross or similar - not my place or style.

I have been called a pervert over this posting, which is very insulting. One person apologized for saying this, so kudos to him. I did leave these comments up (even though it is my page) as to respect to the freedom of speech, and I don't want to be seen as a hypocrite.

And for the record, I am not a nerd, I am a geek - get is straight if you are going to insult somebody.

Now kids - go pick up a fraking book and read it, it will be better time spent that reading the trash I posted that wasn't intended for you anyways. Or go grab a board-game and spend some time with your parents.

Regards,

Lee
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 9:44 pm
Quoting Lee Jones
Ummm, wow; this is way over the top.

There are certainly a lot of good comments and points here. There are also some less than intelligent ones too.

Dave: if my kids came across something that said that you have to be 21 or older to read it, they would not read it. I know you are a good dad Dave, and I know the sacrifices you have made, so please don't think I am insulting you. Just as I was not insulted by your comments.

I expect that all the kids on these pages would be like my kids: "Daddy, is this appropriate?" is what they would ask me. I would expect all the kids to avoid that page. If they don't, then they made a (bad) choice.

I would ask: "Where are these kid's parents?" My kids at almost 12 and 9.5 do not go on the internet unsupervised. They are allowed to go onto webkinz, and similar. They are not allowed to go onto mocpages/flikr/facebook, where they can be exposed to interactions with adults - PERIOD!

I am not here to parent these kids, I am here to interact with the AFOLs and the mature TFOLs. I comment on kids mocs (even Halo and Clone Wars) to be encouraging. I am not parenting. If these kid's parents are allowing them to go on these sites unsupervised, then I think the shame is closer to their homes than it is to mine.

I have no shame for what I posted, it is an artistic expression. It is tasteless humour sure, it is immature too. But it is my page. I am not religious, but I would not put down somebody for posting a cross or similar - not my place or style.

I have been called a pervert over this posting, which is very insulting. One person apologized for saying this, so kudos to him. I did leave these comments up (even though it is my page) as to respect to the freedom of speech, and I don't want to be seen as a hypocrite.

And for the record, I am not a nerd, I am a geek - get is straight if you are going to insult somebody.

Now kids - go pick up a fraking book and read it, it will be better time spent that reading the trash I posted that wasn't intended for you anyways. Or go grab a board-game and spend some time with your parents.

Regards,

Lee
how about you show some maturity about your postings

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 10:01 pm
You know, you could just increase font size and make a big "WARNING: MATURE CONTENT" in red so that even the most unobservant of children could see it. That's what I'd do, at least.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 10:27 pm
Quoting Lee Jones
I expect that all the kids on these pages would be like my kids: "Daddy, is this appropriate?" is what they would ask me...

I wish I could have met your young ones at the Brick convention. They sound like very pleasurable children.

Quoting Lee Jones
And for the record, I am not a nerd, I am a geek - get is straight if you are going to insult somebody.

Now kids - go pick up a fraking book and read it... Or go grab a board-game and spend some time with your parents...
Hence the reason this man is one of my favorite builders - he's genius... Very well put Lee, I loved the part about the book!
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 10:30 pm
Quoting Lee Jones
I have no shame for what I posted, it is an artistic expression. It is tasteless humour sure, it is immature too.
I'm sorry for not seeing whatever twisted "art" that is supposedly in this. I typically expect some level of restraint and moderation from people like you, but I can see that I was expecting waaaaay too much from the AFOLs here. Sorry for having such ridiculous expectations and some form of respect.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:02 pm
 Group admin 
Quoting Lt. John Harland
Quoting Lee Jones
I have no shame for what I posted, it is an artistic expression. It is tasteless humour sure, it is immature too.
I'm sorry for not seeing whatever twisted "art" that is supposedly in this. I typically expect some level of restraint and moderation from people like you, but I can see that I was expecting waaaaay too much from the AFOLs here. Sorry for having such ridiculous expectations and some form of respect.


Aren't you the same guy who goes around forcing your religious beliefs on other people? Where's the respect for the Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, Hindi or whatever other religion someone else is? I was really trying to avoid this based on my own religious beliefs, but for you to attack someone for "offending" you by posting some jokes on his OWN page, when you go around and post your religious beliefs on everyone elses site/group/page... How do you know what religion someone else is? Your comments could very well be the MOST offensive thing here that someone else has ever encountered. People fight WARS over religion... no one ever fought a war over a lego joke.

Again, I didn't want to go down this road because of my own religious beliefs (You'll all notice, I still haven't said what those beliefs are. I'm not going to force them down your throat.) Think twice about what you say and who you say it to. You never know WHO you're offending.

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:11 pm
Quoting Thomas N
did you not read everything that he wrote, or are you just continuing your tirade by replying to whatever comment he left, just because you saw his name. By the nature of your response, it doesn't look like you read it at all.

i did and im still offended
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:13 pm
Clearly no matter what I say you guys are grounded in your view so... whatever. And by the way I never forced my beliefs on any one ever.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:15 pm
Quoting Thomas N
did you not read everything that he wrote, or are you just continuing your tirade by replying to whatever comment he left, just because you saw his name. By the nature of your response, it doesn't look like you read it at all.


From my experiences in debates with Harland, I think he might read the comments, but he doesn't answer them often. I remember being frustrated whenever he dodged a question or a point and moved onto something else entirely, ignoring everything I had said. I seem to remember him doing this to Phaze and several others as well... Of course, maybe he just assumes that whatever answers he gives will be taken as the response to the writing. No one knows but him, in the end.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:15 pm
Quoting Awesome-o-saurus The Not-So-Great

From my experiences in debates with Harland, I think he might read the comments, but he doesn't answer them often. I remember being frustrated whenever he dodged a question or a point and moved onto something else entirely, ignoring everything I had said. I seem to remember him doing this to Phaze and several others as well... Of course, maybe he just assumes that whatever answers he gives will be taken as the response to the writing. No one knows but him, in the end.
I remember doing that to you because you were annoyingly vague but I dont remember doing that to Phaze or anyone else. And I did that in the CFOL and look at what I am there.

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:24 pm
Quoting Brian peczyna
As much as I disagree that the content in lee's moc is inapropriate, (especially for mocpages) I just try to stay out of it. It's not my fight to pick. Sure I'm a kid, But i'm mature enough to see the difference between right and wrong. I'm also mature enough to realize that just becuase Lee acts a certain way, And does certain things doesen't make it right, and it sure doesen't mean that I should act the same, And do the same things, Just becuase he's older than me.
Oops, I meant that it is inapropriate.

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:27 pm
Quoting Thomas N
Running any sort of content protection or age moderation system would take up enormous amounts of Sean's time and effort.

First off, he would need some sort of system implemented that gave him the age of every member on this site. That in itself would require huge amounts of work and time.

Then, such a system would also require every single MOC added to be screened for content and divided into categories based on age appropriateness. Requiring either actual people looking over every MOC, or a piece of software with nearly human-like abilities to weed out any sort of inappropriate content, whether actually lego built or in writing. There is no system capable of that. Think of every slang word and obscure reference that could possibly be used to suggest inappropriate content. Searching with accuracy enough to find what's innocent and not wouldn't be possible short of an set of workers, that Sean can't pay, checking every MOC.

The only other way of sorting good MOCs from bad would be for the creators themselves to select what age group should view their particular MOC. I'm sure that almost every AFOL would be willing to do this if it were ever implemented, but how are we to trust every single person who could possibly add an inappropriate MOC?

Bottom line, it would be extremely costly and time consuming for a system such as that to ever be implemented now, with so many users and MOCs already out there, and thousands more to come. I don't remember having to give my age when signing up for my account, so I doubt there is any age-monitoring system set up to track the ages of every MOCcer. There really isn't a practical way to pull that off.
I'm not asking for the site to be moderated I understand how hard that would be. I am asking for some judgement on the part of the MOC's creator I hardly think thats asking alot.
Bottom line: show some judgement people
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:28 pm
Quoting Thomas N

long post



Unless there was a way for the MOCer to choose an option to make the MOC restricted, and a way for members to to select what kinds of MOCs they want to see. Like the comments on youtube, in a way. If you select only safe MOCs to see, that's all you'll see. If you want to see MOCs of all kinds, select that, and ones like the MOC that started all this will show up and you'll be able to check them out.

But, that'd take a while to program too.

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:31 pm
Quoting Lt. John Harland
I remember doing that to you because you were annoyingly vague but I dont remember doing that to Phaze or anyone else. And I did that in the CFOL and look at what I am there.


Well, I don't recall being annoyingly vague, rather, very straight forward from my point of veiw. But, if you say so. And I don't know what you are there, thought I'd point that out.

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:32 pm
Quoting Awesome-o-saurus The Not-So-Great
Unless there was a way for the MOCer to choose an option to make the MOC restricted, and a way for members to to select what kinds of MOCs they want to see. Like the comments on youtube, in a way. If you select only safe MOCs to see, that's all you'll see. If you want to see MOCs of all kinds, select that, and ones like the MOC that started all this will show up and you'll be able to check them out.

But, that'd take a while to program too.

And using some judgement is of course out of the question.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:33 pm
Let's all take a moment and wonder where Ryan went... Didn't he say something about 'not being quiet for another second'?
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:33 pm
Quoting Awesome-o-saurus The Not-So-Great

Well, I don't recall being annoyingly vague, rather, very straight forward from my point of veiw. But, if you say so. And I don't know what you are there, thought I'd point that out.
If you were ever straight forward I missed it.

Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:34 pm
Quoting Lt. John Harland
If you were ever straight forward I missed it.


As did I. Memory isn't my strongest skill, you know. Anyways, we're off topic, let's get back to the debate at hand.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:38 pm
Quoting Awesome-o-saurus The Not-So-Great

As did I. Memory isn't my strongest skill, you know. Anyways, we're off topic, let's get back to the debate at hand.

okay so why cant the builder use some judgement.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:40 pm
Quoting Thomas N
Yes, but who classifies all the "safe" MOCs. Who is going to sort through all 177,397 current MOCs and classify them as safe or unsafe?


Their owners. Maybe. I don't know. If someone has sketchy material in their MOCs, then they presumably know what it is and that some people might not like it because of their preferences.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:40 pm
Quoting Lt. John Harland
okay so why cant the builder use some judgement.


Judgment, along with opinion and personality and the like varies. What Lee thinks he can post obviously varies from what you think you can post. While you'd like to see that MOC removed, Lee doesn't, and third parties, such as myself, really don't care. Fourth parties, fifth parties, and so on, all think different things. Different people do have different values, thus the conflict at hand here.
Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:42 pm
 Group admin 
Allow me to refer you all to number 5 under Reviews, user-created pages, and other content
in "Conditions of use."

5. We may delete or edit bad things.
MOCpages.com reserves the right (but not the obligation) to remove or edit content that violates any of these terms, but does not regularly review posted content. It is your responsibility to monitor content to a level appropriate to yourself and/or your family.


Allow me to repeat the part that NEEDS repeating here...

"It is YOUR responsibility to monitor content to a level appropriate to yourself and/or your family."

Any questions? Thought not. End of discussion.




Permalink
| January 6, 2010, 11:50 pm
Quoting Lt. John Harland
Quoting Lee Jones
I have no shame for what I posted, it is an artistic expression. It is tasteless humour sure, it is immature too.
I'm sorry for not seeing whatever twisted "art" that is supposedly in this. I typically expect some level of restraint and moderation from people like you, but I can see that I was expecting waaaaay too much from the AFOLs here. Sorry for having such ridiculous expectations and some form of respect.


Well if increasing exposure to my MOC was both your and my goal, then I should thank you. Even more people are visiting it since you started your drama show here. I guess it is true that there is no such thing as bad publicity.

Lee

Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 12:08 am
Yeah. Adults come here too and they have the same right to see Lee's MOC as the next kid has the right to check out his speeder bikes and AT-ATs.
Parental control should be left... well, to parents.
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 12:33 am
This seems a ridiculous thread now.

There are slurs on religion, lifestyle, social and parental aptitude and writing IN CAPS which is never a sign of friendly banter.

I'd take the Facebook model - they delete anything inappropriate that can be accessed by others as a matter of principle. So does YouTube.

Yes they could put a warning at the start of the video stating the content, and according to some posters in here, all would be well. My guess is if YouTube changed their policy to do this, it would take about 3 hours before p07n outnumbered everything else uploaded since the site's birth.

MOCpages is (was) one of the few child-friendly places on the net. Yes many adult themed MOCs are funny, but if we are responsible we will not put our requirement for a laugh (which we can get from numerous places) over the right a child has to be safe on an area of the internet which is based around a toy.

It's not a problem with MOCpages, it's a problem with us - the users, exploiting the fact it doesn't have a lock on the door. That to me, is not an excuse.

MOCpages is still for me, a great site, but it's users are driving me away. There are posts in this thread from big cheeses of the MOCpages hierachy that I am truly dissapointed with.

I'll leave you with this thought:

If the p07n clip accidentally shown during the superbowl last year had contained a warning at the start, would it have been acceptable?

A.F out

Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 7:14 am
I agree with Apr Fight. This thread is way too over the top. And let me say this: The AFOL's that hang around MOCpages are jokers, and grown-ups. They warn you (sometimes) about MOCs and make sure you don't take it the wrong way. If you were younger than 21 and read it because you thought it would be "a funny lie". Once you read you came write to the people who made it or starred in it and told. There is not a single need to go around "protesting". Just let the Head people of MOCpages to take care of it.

Now the offensive comments going around in this thread are sort-of, well not what people should be doing (No rudeness to whoever puts there religion/beliefs on-top of others.) Remember, we still have some freedom to do what we want in OUR creations. (Hint)>>> So, it's in the rules, remeber that. Just DON'T look at the MOC, and you will be happy!

~Joe
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 7:33 am
Quoting Areetsa C

Well, as I said elsewhere, if the average person had any brains at all us sensible TFOLs would probably be more sociable.


I got a lot of flack from the "United artists" for stating my opinion, which wis mis read, and I got yelled at, and yet I still try. I am beginning to think there is no point.
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 8:30 am
Quoting Chris Phipson


And as for YOU being offended? What do you think you just did to me? Someone else posts something that YOU don't like so you come over here and INSULT me and my parenting skills? What's your problem? Before you go off on your holy crusade, maybe you should think twice about who you're going after. I didn't do ANYTHING to you and your insult will NOT be forgotten any time soon.

Thank you Chris. You stated everything I wanted to, but since I did not feel it was my place, I left it alone. Your feelings here mirror my own. I am a Father of a 10 year old, I have a career, and a life. I was briefly offended by Ryan's comments until I thought about the source, then I just laughed. Thanks for summing up the feelings of some of us "lifeless" AFOL's. Cheers.
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 10:04 am
Quoting Phazezorz .
No, me.

And it basically means I am acting higher in manner than Ryan.

Though it is all opinons, I presume.

If you are 13, you are indeed mature beyond your years. Bravo.
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 10:05 am
Quoting Phazezorz .
Aye, thanks. Though a personal meeting might prove otherwise...

<.<
>.>

HAHAHAHAHAHA
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 12:28 pm
siiiiigh you all are arguing of Lee's (possible) mistake.....anyone told Sean about this....does he know about how you all are fighting he is the one who created mocpages so he should be the one who see's if this is a problem or not.....I am sure all mocpage moderators have very high authority and blah blah blah...but why don't we just leave it to him....how bout is guys....how bout it.
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 1:40 pm
Quoting James Hawke
...the only way it started is because ,John here, is a CFOL, I mean what's up with that...

Their job is too keep MOCpages running smoothly, in their memo it doesn't say they actually have to even reply to you, so your lucky their even here to talk calmly with you and you don't even appreciate that.


I disagree with you on both points; firstly the dig at the faith of another Lego builder, and second the 'talk calmly with you'. In parts of this thread, calmness by Mods is not evident - which considering they are talking to children, is saddening.

For me Lego is about a toy that brings joy to millions of children. This site is therefore for them first, everyone else second.

Sometimes we seem to think that the older the builder, the more right they have to be here. I'd say the opposite.

Personally, I think MOCers need to accept the *primary* role of Lego as is a toy, rather than as a means for adults (and I count myself too here) to amuse themselves.

For me the way people communicate with one another online is more of a threat to children than the MOC which started all of this in the first place.

Some of the AFOL replies to the kids in this thread are completely unacceptable.

And for that reason, I count myself out.

Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 2:58 pm
Although, this may be my living room, this is still Sean's house.

Because of the attention this moc has received, which was not my intention - it was built for my adult friends, it ended up on the explorer page. As such the content of this moc is blocked until further notice.

Regards,

Lee.
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 3:04 pm
Quoting Ape Fight

I'd take the Facebook model - they delete anything inappropriate that can be accessed by others as a matter of principle. So does YouTube.


Well, Facebook you choose if it's bad and report it, so you can swear all you want, by the way.

Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 3:44 pm
Quoting J. V
siiiiigh you all are arguing of Lee's (possible) mistake.....anyone told Sean about this....does he know about how you all are fighting he is the one who created mocpages so he should be the one who see's if this is a problem or not.....I am sure all mocpage moderators have very high authority and blah blah blah...but why don't we just leave it to him....how bout is guys....how bout it.


You need Mods, though, because otherwise the cleaning of "innapropriate content" would take longer.
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 3:48 pm
 Group admin 
Quoting Ape Fight
In parts of this thread, calmness by Mods is not evident - which considering they are talking to children, is saddening.


I'll agree that there were times in this thread where I was yelling. When were those parts you ask? When I was being personally insulted and attacked by someone who knows nothing about me or my life. True he's a kid, I get that but even kids need to learn a lesson from time to time. I only wish their parents would have done it. Parenting other peoples kids isn't in my job discription.


Quoting Ape Fight
For me Lego is about a toy that brings joy to millions of children. This site is therefore for them first, everyone else second. Sometimes we seem to think that the older the builder, the more right they have to be here. I'd say the opposite. Personally, I think MOCers need to accept the *primary* role of Lego as is a toy, rather than as a means for adults (and I count myself too here) to amuse themselves.


I respectfully disagree. I was a kid who played with Lego when I was young and grew into an adult who still loves Lego. This site is for everyone. From 2 to 102, no one age bracket is more deserving than any other.


Quoting Ape Fight
For me the way people communicate with one another online is more of a threat to children than the MOC which started all of this in the first place.

Some of the AFOL replies to the kids in this thread are completely unacceptable.

And for that reason, I count myself out.


As I stated above, my comments directed at certain disrepectful individuals were not in regards to the moc that started it. Rather, I was defending my self from personal attacks. Now granted, the kids are in fact just that, kids, but even kids need to learn some respect for others and know what battle to fight based on thier personal beliefs. If this thread was only about the content of Lee's moc, the conversation would have gone a LOT differently. Unfortunately, some people decided to attack me personally when I had done nothing to offend him. That's what the main issue was.


Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 4:50 pm
Quoting Lee Jones
Ummm, wow; this is way over the top.

There are certainly a lot of good comments and points here. There are also some less than intelligent ones too.

Dave: if my kids came across something that said that you have to be 21 or older to read it, they would not read it. I know you are a good dad Dave, and I know the sacrifices you have made, so please don't think I am insulting you. Just as I was not insulted by your comments.

I expect that all the kids on these pages would be like my kids: "Daddy, is this appropriate?" is what they would ask me. I would expect all the kids to avoid that page. If they don't, then they made a (bad) choice.

I would ask: "Where are these kid's parents?" My kids at almost 12 and 9.5 do not go on the internet unsupervised. They are allowed to go onto webkinz, and similar. They are not allowed to go onto mocpages/flikr/facebook, where they can be exposed to interactions with adults - PERIOD!

I am not here to parent these kids, I am here to interact with the AFOLs and the mature TFOLs. I comment on kids mocs (even Halo and Clone Wars) to be encouraging. I am not parenting. If these kid's parents are allowing them to go on these sites unsupervised, then I think the shame is closer to their homes than it is to mine.

I have no shame for what I posted, it is an artistic expression. It is tasteless humour sure, it is immature too. But it is my page. I am not religious, but I would not put down somebody for posting a cross or similar - not my place or style.

I have been called a pervert over this posting, which is very insulting. One person apologized for saying this, so kudos to him. I did leave these comments up (even though it is my page) as to respect to the freedom of speech, and I don't want to be seen as a hypocrite.

And for the record, I am not a nerd, I am a geek - get is straight if you are going to insult somebody.

Now kids - go pick up a fraking book and read it, it will be better time spent that reading the trash I posted that wasn't intended for you anyways. Or go grab a board-game and spend some time with your parents.

Regards,

Lee

After I knew what it was, I didn't go see it. I am a mature CFOL (regardless of my sisters nasty thoughts about me...)
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 4:56 pm
 Group admin 
I believe we've beaten this issue to it's bitter demise. I'm going to lock the thread now. If anyone has anything "important" that needs to be said, please address it to either Mark or I in our threads.
Permalink
| January 7, 2010, 5:32 pm
Group moderators have locked this conversation.
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