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Most of us have seen teachers up close and personal during the course of our schooling. Most of us have also seen the vast array of news, paraphernalia, and propaganda lauding teachers and the teaching profession in general. But do teachers measure up to their PR campaign? Are these people underpaid sages who deserve to be paid the same salaries as professional sports players, or are they merely grade-school level scholars who lack the academic fortitude to compete with adults in the professional workforce?
So the question is: Do the majority of teachers deserve the admiration that they expect us to give them? (I am sure there are gems and tumors in the lot, but lets talk majorities)
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| August 10, 2013, 4:42 pm
 Group admin 
Firstly, there's already an education debate, but I guess this is fine.
The propaganda from teachers hasn't been too bad in my schools. The only ones that clearly show their opinion are right anyway, and the uninformed people in my classes need it. Regarding teacher pay, the reason most teachers are paid barely enough is that they get almost half of the year off, seeing as there's 185 days of school (or around here at least). Teachers in places like Chicago make $75K PLUS lavish benefits. Sure, the cost of living is higher there, but not THAT much higher.
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| August 10, 2013, 8:00 pm
Most of the teachers where I go to school don't even want to be there and therefore don't do a very good job. There are a few exceptions, and there are some teachers I really like, but mostly they're sub-par.
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| August 10, 2013, 9:45 pm
 Group admin 
Teachers struggling to teach a class of unruly children is a waste of time and money when compared to homeschooling.
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| August 16, 2013, 8:31 am
Well, first off, I think professional sports players should be payed the same as teachers. But that's another debate. ;)

In my experience with the school system, teachers in elementary and junior high schools are pretty much distributors of colouring books and worksheets. Of course, large classes and disruptive/brainless kids prevent advanced tutelage. However, in high school there are many teachers who excel in their fields, and are likely underpaid for the work they do. Granted, some are better than others, but on average they seem a tad underpaid. (Of course, with a pay raise comes a taxation raise, so...)
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| August 16, 2013, 12:36 pm
Maybe teachers should be paid in the same WAY athletes do, by merit? Pay the good ones more, get rid of the bad ones. But if they start using 'roids, then ban 'em!
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| August 16, 2013, 2:06 pm
I like the idea of merit based pay, but like with most things, its the "how" that is the puzzling part. One cannot unjustly reward teachers for getting smart kids by luck just as one cannot punish teachers who end up teaching in the inner cities or trailer parks where the majority of kids are either morons or uninterested. Now, for my 2 cents. The majority of teachers that I have had deserve pay just below minimum wage. They provided me with an education that was just below minimum. They prepared me for a dead-end job doing something for just below minimum wage pay. Like a ditch digger, gas station attendant, or janitor.
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| August 16, 2013, 3:19 pm
 Group admin 
They get paid so little because they're off almost half the year.
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| August 16, 2013, 6:30 pm
What teachers are you debate here? Teachers in USA? Are they that bad?
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| August 18, 2013, 6:18 am
Quoting Locutus 666
What teachers are you debate here? Teachers in USA? Are they that bad?
We are primarily debating US teachers. Whether they are that bad is the subject of the debate.
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| August 18, 2013, 3:10 pm
What are we debating here, are we debating test scores, student behavior, teacher behavior, inner city schools, teaching methods, discipline methods. Lot of topics we could talk about.
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| August 18, 2013, 4:35 pm
Paying a teacher way is investing in the future. It should be hard to remain a teacher, but also well paid. That is ultimo-motivation.

Who says they are off half a year? First off, they work twice as much at home as in school, since they have to prepare lessons and correct tests. Secondly, "free holidays" are a myth. How about students who have to fix their grades during summer holidays or correcting of maturity exams from both spring and autumn?
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| August 18, 2013, 4:59 pm
Quoting Michael K.
They get paid so little because they're off almost half the year.

Being in the book business, I can tell you that I am selling school books to teachers all throughout the summer. I talk to them constantly about how busy they are for their job even though school is out. They're planning for the coming year. Near the end of the summer, they're in the school preparing the classrooms. The students are out of school for three months, but for teachers, no students in the school does not mean off.
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| August 18, 2013, 5:16 pm
Quoting Twig22 (an American)
What are we debating here, are we debating test scores, student behavior, teacher behavior, inner city schools, teaching methods, discipline methods. Lot of topics we could talk about.


teachers, teachers, and only teachers.
Permalink
| August 18, 2013, 6:29 pm
Quoting Twig22 (an American)
What are we debating here, are we debating test scores, student behavior, teacher behavior, inner city schools, teaching methods, discipline methods. Lot of topics we could talk about.


To keep debate going, opening the focus of the debate a little wider seems a wise move. More things to consider: How can good teachers be provided incentive to continue their high performance, and how can poor instructors be shown the door? How would performance be measured without the results being skewed by students who are either smarter than average or below average?
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| August 23, 2013, 7:06 pm
Quoting JWG 258

To keep debate going, opening the focus of the debate a little wider seems a wise move. More things to consider: How can good teachers be provided incentive to continue their high performance, and how can poor instructors be shown the door? How would performance be measured without the results being skewed by students who are either smarter than average or below average?

Abolish the teacher's unions.
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| August 25, 2013, 10:37 am
 Group admin 
Quoting JWG 258 How would performance be measured without the results being skewed by students who are either smarter than average or below average?
Inspectors with knowledge about teaching could evaluate teachers without looking at their students' test scores. Perhaps the principal of each school should have this kind of training.
Permalink
| August 25, 2013, 12:34 pm
Quoting JWG 258
Most of us have seen teachers up close and personal during the course of our schooling. Most of us have also seen the vast array of news, paraphernalia, and propaganda lauding teachers and the teaching profession in general. But do teachers measure up to their PR campaign? Are these people underpaid sages who deserve to be paid the same salaries as professional sports players, or are they merely grade-school level scholars who lack the academic fortitude to compete with adults in the professional workforce?
So the question is: Do the majority of teachers deserve the admiration that they expect us to give them? (I am sure there are gems and tumors in the lot, but lets talk majorities)

I'm replying directly to this comment for three main reasons:

Firstly:
Please do not get me started on "professional" Sports "Stars". We'd be here all year and the admins and Mods would be working overtime getting my comments through the filter

Secondly:
What? Teacher get good PR in your country? Wow. Down here teachers are really seen as that later description you provided.

Thirdly:
My opinion on the matter! Here it comes:
We cannot truly talk majorities here, as there are three classes of teachers:
One: The Fresh Faces: Never had a "real" job, went from school to tertiary education to teaching. These ones do not necessarily deserve the high pay that (in my country at least) they are demanding
Second: The Experienced Ones: These teachers are generally older, and have either been teaching a long time, or have had a "real" job before coming to teaching. These teachers deserve high levels of pay. They provide quality education to young kids, many of whom do not appreciate it.
Third: The AMAZING Teachers: This group fall into a category of their own. They may be young, or old, but either way, they generally teach one subject, or one group of subjects (i.e. Sciences, Humanities, Maths, etc.) and they teach it with such passion, energy, and impressive levels of student engagement that they actually produce results from even the most reluctant student. These teacher deserve as much money as we can give them

There you go people.
Permalink
| August 25, 2013, 3:31 pm
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